Roshni Malde on winning the UCL Chemistry Ramsay medal

In this month's episode, Malcolm and Maymana sit with Roshni to ask about her experiences of being a PhD, including the most important question - what is a Photoactive Protein Bioconjugate?

Malcolm Chalmers  0:10  
Hello and welcome to Hypot-enthuse podcast at the Faculty of mathematical and physical sciences at UCL, or as we like to call it MAPS. I am your host Malcolm I'm here with my co host Maymana. 

Maymana Arefin  0:23  
Hi everyone. 

Malcolm Chalmers  0:24  
And today we are speaking with Roshni Malde, who is a PhD student in the chemistry department at UCL, and was recently the winner of the Ramsay medal for 20 1920 on behalf of the work that she'd done in the department, which we'll come into in a minute, Roshni, thank you for joining us. 

Roshni Malde  0:41  
Thank you very much for welcoming me to begin with. 

Malcolm Chalmers  0:43  
Congratulations on winning the Ramsay medal. How much did you know about the Ramsey model before you won it? Were you deliberately planning to win it? Or was it kind of a nice surprise?

Roshni Malde  0:53  
Definitely a nice surprise. Well, I knew about it for sure. Because like it happens every year in the department, you do your final year talk. And then the winners of those go forward to the Ramsay medal. So I didn't know about it. But I didn't even expect to win like the first round. So yeah, very unexpected.

Malcolm Chalmers  1:10  
Yeah, so I was gonna say the metal was won for. Now let me see if I can get the actual title. Yeah, I think

Maymana Arefin  1:17  
it's a is it was it called the development and studies of photo active protein bio conjugates.

Malcolm Chalmers  1:27  
So So I think the first three questions that we would have? Well, the first question, I think comes to mind for me is, what is a photoactive protein bioconjugate.

Roshni Malde  1:37  
hard to explain, but I'm gonna try and simplify it as much as possible. And I guess to explain that I first have to tell you what a protein bioconjugate is. So essentially, if you've got a protein and existing protein, and you attach on a small molecule, or any molecule for that matter, that is then called a protein bioconjugate. And that can be useful because it allows you to sort of study the function of protein. So it helps biologists to understand how proteins work. But also, I think more exciting is you can attach on so many other things you can attach on a fluorophore, for example, which would allow you to do some imaging, you can even attach on drugs, which would allow targeted therapeutics and stuff. So yeah, very cool.

Malcolm Chalmers  2:22  
What would be the process then for, for using one of these proteins in a drug by situation? For example, how would the bioconjugate be used in that situation?

Roshni Malde  2:32  
I guess one example that comes to mind is probably ADCs, which are antibody drug conjugates. So the antibody is your protein, and you attach on a drug to that, and how that is more beneficial than just having a normal drug is that the antibody is specific for the cancer cells that it's going to. So it can essentially deliver your antibody drug combination to a particular cancer site, and therefore, you can have targeted therapeutics. So this is sort of better than like, the traditional chemotherapy methods that we've got, which will, you always hear about all the side effects that chemotherapy has. So in this way, because you're just targeting the cancer cells, you're going to have less damage to healthy tissues. And so that's so much more beneficial, so much more attractive, even for patients really.

Malcolm Chalmers  3:20  
So we've talked a little bit about what what protein bioconjugate would be. So what's the photo active elements of that? Why? Why are the photo active protein bioconjugates have specific interest to you?

Roshni Malde  3:31  
Well, I guess it means that you can, you can control the like place in time, which you would always activate your protein. So say you've got a protein bioconjugate as I was talking about, it's like a pro drug in that it could be inactive in that form. But then if you then go and shine light on it, you can activate your protein. So essentially, it's like turning the protein on at a specific time and place when you when you shine the light on it. Yeah, that's basically where my work is going.

Maymana Arefin  3:59  
What what sorts of equipment does that involve? Like? I'm trying to, how can I imagine exactly like what what it is that you use in the lab in order to kind of switch off the bioconjugates, for example.

Roshni Malde  4:12  
And so if I'm working on like, just on chemistry molecules, essentially, I would use like a Mercury lamp to do these radiations and so on. But then obviously, that's going to be so harsh, because there's so much power with those mercury lamps. So if you're trying to do it on like bioconjugates, which are like tiny little things, and eppendorf you would be doing using like a little torch or something to do it. So that's how that works.

Malcolm Chalmers  4:37  
So I'm guessing, for example, that if you had a protein bioconjugate that was going to be used to treat something like stomach cancer to think of an example. Would you then try and shine a light into somebody's stomach to try and activate it or

Roshni Malde  4:55  
any This is going to be a question. No, because as we know, like I'm using at the moment is all UV radiation. So that's definitely not a good idea, you're probably just going to get because of cancer. So yeah, not not a great idea at the moment. But I guess so where this would be useful at the moment, I guess would be for in vitro studies, it just allows you to like study how this could possibly be an effect, rather than actually treating cancer, it could be allowed to understand the function of something, and so on like that. But yeah, eventually, I guess it would be very cool. If you could be treating cancer, for example, with lights or how that would work as you would have to use a different kind of light, you'd have to use IR radiation or something like that, which you can shine at people without causing them more damage. So yeah, I guess that would be very cool in the future, but this is way far off, especially for the work I'm doing. I mean, there are things out there like that. But yeah, for the stuff I'm doing, it's more in studying things rather than for actual treatment,

Maymana Arefin  5:57  
I realized that I'm not sure if we actually asked you to, we asked you what our protein bioconjugate was, did we ask you to summarize, I don't think we asked you to summarize your the speech that you gave for the Ramsey mental.

Roshni Malde  6:09  
I haven't really but I guess. So I guess there's a class of molecules that I'm basically working with called layer mice. And they can do two different types of reactions. One is the to pursue cycloaddition reaction, which probably means nothing to you. But that's okay, in terms of in terms of an application, what it could mean is, like I was saying, if you've attached your williamite to a protein, you could then have that as your inactive form of the protein. And then if you shine light on it, the two plus two reaction occurs, and the protein will then sort of undergo this conformational change. And that could cause an activation of the protein. So that's one of the things that I'm sort of looking at. And then the other one is, if you've got your protein bound to the Malaya amide, which is then bound to a drug, or any sort of attached cargo, which that drugs, say is in its inactive form again, and then you shine light on it, and you can cause release of this drug, which would then be in its active form. So that those are the two sort of areas that I'm looking at. And yeah,

Maymana Arefin  7:16  
exploring those at the moment, just to kind of build upon that. Was there any kind of particular reason why you chose to go into this area of kind of cancer cells and something that I think sounds like it relates a lot to biology, as well as the chemistry sort of background. And so I know from what you said that you can use these bioconjugates in so many ways, you probably can reveal some how enzymes are functioning or protein sort of distribution, all sorts of things. So what is it that made you get into the cancer application?

Roshni Malde  7:48  
I guess it's not just cancer, I think for me, it was always about just generally using science to help medicines in general, not just cancer, sort of like a range of them. I guess, because I had back at school, I had some work experience at GSK. And that, for me is what sort of made me more passionate about sort of using science to improve people's lives, improve people, improve people's lives, help people that are suffering, I guess. So I think that's what it was. Yeah, so that's sort of how I got into this sort of thing,

Malcolm Chalmers  8:21  
speaking about, you know, having having a history of working in this kind of field. So your master's thesis was related in similar areas, improving the therapeutic activity of potential drug molecules by using the phosphoramidite product technology, that that's correct. And this was actually this actually led to a publication, which is not particularly common for master's level work, I think it's safe to say, I mean, how that must have been an interesting experience to be a master student have the work that you do go towards, you know, publication in the Journal of medicinal chemistry, right.

Roshni Malde  8:58  
Yeah, definitely. Yeah, that was such an achievement. I mean, I guess it was a lot of people working on that stuff. So I did some of the work. The master's student before me did a lot of work on it, the postdocs and a lot of work on it as well. So it was sort of collaborative working that led to that publication. But yeah, definitely is such an achievement to have that publication for sure.

Maymana Arefin  9:18  
I guess that was in 2018. So that must have been before a lot of the situation that we have now, which you were just describing to us before the cost of rotors and shifts to go into lab. So what was that like kind of actually doing that collaborative working in the lab?

Roshni Malde  9:34  
Yeah, that was definitely a good experience. Um, with that, though, although I say it was collaborative working. It was sort of asynchronously, almost like I did the work. Someone else did the work before me kind of thing. Especially because when I was there, my supervisor actually moved because I did my undergrad at Birmingham, but my supervisor moved to Cardiff in the middle of my hair in the middle of my master's. So yeah, it was a bit interesting. But yeah, definitely still a good experience. So.

Malcolm Chalmers  10:03  
So one thing that came up for me when we were researching this is, I noticed one term, both in your master's work and your current work, which I was not familiar with. Could you explain what a pro drug is,

Roshni Malde  10:16  
essentially, you've got your drug, which would be its active form. So a pro drug is something that isn't in its active form. But once it goes into the body, something will happen to it, and it will become in its active form against that's essentially what a pro drug is.

Maymana Arefin  10:31  
I hadn't come across the word project before looking into your work as well. And I realized that some really quite well known projects are projects like, for example, things like aspirin, I think there were a few that I was surprised by,

Roshni Malde  10:45  
I think, yeah, a lot of them will be because they don't they're not in its active form until they react within your body. I guess. So. Yeah.

Malcolm Chalmers  10:54  
So was it a case that you haven't done the work on the Masters that automatically opened up a field to you and made you go, this is what I want to do my PhD in

Roshni Malde  11:03  
thought of, I did really enjoy my master's project, the whole medicinal chemistry, how it sort of played a role in the bigger pictures, like things towards medicines and stuff. So I didn't know I sort of wanted to carry on in that field. But whether I wanted to do a PhD or not was questionable. I wasn't definitely sure I wanted to. So sort of at the time, I was applying for both jobs, and PhDs and stuff. But I knew I wanted to stay in that field. Regardless, I assume now approaching the end of your PhD. Do you feel you made the right decision? Definitely. Yes. Yeah. I'm so glad I'm here at UCL doing a Chem bio PhD. Yeah, for sure. I mean, like, you learn so many skills and a PhD, I think, and I think that's something you probably don't get an industry. So yeah, definitely glad, for sure. Just off the back of that, as well. So

Maymana Arefin  11:53  
what's up in like, if you could kind of describe what it's like to do a PhD at UCLA? What How would you describe a PhD? That's kind of a few stages ahead. But what it feels like and what what the experience has been like for you,

Roshni Malde  12:06  
I guess. It's just a journey in itself. Yeah, you just learned so many new things with it. I mean, it's always starts off as something completely new, it's a whole new project, you have no idea about it. And then sort of as the year progresses, you start learning new things. And you sort of use you start just believing in yourself about it or in like, understanding everything. And then you sort of realize that you're probably like the one person that knows so much about that one particular tiny, little area. So it's quite nice, definitely. But I think also, technically, you learn so many new skills as well. Like, I'm only just starting to do some more Chem bio stuff. So that's quite cool as well, for me learning new skills there. So yeah, definitely recommend it for anyone that would want to do it. Who wants to go into science? Definitely.

Malcolm Chalmers  12:57  
We were just talking about the current arrangement. So you're part of the chemistry department, UCL, you're still doing your research, even while lockdown is in place. So can you talk a little bit about how how the pandemic has affected that the kind of changes that you've had to bring in for your work over the last year compared to what was happening Previous to that?

Roshni Malde  13:17  
Yeah, so obviously, we went into lockdown last March. And then we were off for like, three, four months, I think we weren't in the lab. So yeah, that was quite interesting. It just meant a lot of reading around the subject, writing up my thesis, that kind of thing. And then when we went back, it's sort of gone into cohort systems. So we're essentially on a router when we can when we cough type of thing, sort of last time we ended up doing a few weeks in and then we cough. And that wasn't so bad. It gives you that break, it almost allows you to plan your work, which probably before we weren't doing so well. So probably a good thing, but I think it gets more stressful now,

Malcolm Chalmers  13:55  
are you suggesting that the pandemic has improved your efficiency? Partially.

Roshni Malde  14:02  
I think you never really take a step back before like to just think about what you're doing. You just sort of go into drive and like just do everything you want to do. But you don't really think about what you're doing or analyze your results or anything like that. So in a way, yes, I think I think it does make it a bit more efficient. Although now now that we've gone to the whole one week in when we cough, I think it is a little bit more stressful because you try and you try and pack in so much into the one week that you are in, and then the one week off, you're not not as much to do so pros and cons of it both.

Maymana Arefin  14:35  
It's so nice to hear from a researcher as well that you've kind of had that chance to actually have a bit more headspace because I think if there's anything that comes from the pandemic, it's being able to take a bit of a step back and sort of have that bigger picture, which that sounds like has translated over to your your work as well which is great in terms of your research. So how many people are there in the group and kind of what's it what's the setup like?

Roshni Malde  15:00  
Yeah. So within the beta group, there's, I think, seven members of the group, we're based in the Kathleen Lonsdale building, which isn't the main Chemistry Department building. And then we've also got the two disarmer group who we work very, very closely with, we all do very, very similar things. So it makes a lot of sense. So we share a lot with them. And then there's also the chef group, which we share a lot with. So I think all in all, there must be about maybe 25 people in the lab or something. So yeah, obviously now it's not so many. But yeah.

Malcolm Chalmers  15:33  
In addition to winning the Ramsay medal, I believe you also won the second year PhD poster prize. I did indeed. So this was this was for the second year of PhD work on the same subject area. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Okay. You get to your second year, you present a poster on the work you're doing, you win a prize for it? How do you then progress from that to doing more work, because I would assume that once you've won a prize, it would be very much like a pat on the back, everything's great carry on what you're doing. So then kind of get that response and go, Okay, I need to now improve on certain areas. It's easy to improve when you're told what's wrong. But when you get a prize, you're told everything you're doing is brilliant. How do you then improve on the work from from that point?

Roshni Malde  16:23  
I guess with those poster sessions, it's actually quite nice. So I mean, well, it happened virtually this year. But when I did it, it was all in person in the no home room. You just all like everyone in your year has their posters up. And then people come around and ask you questions, and people ask you questions, and you think about like, Oh, yeah, I hadn't thought about that. Maybe that's something I could do as well. And you get a lot of feedback that way. So I think that sort of motivates you a little bit to carry on,

Maymana Arefin  16:49  
that makes me think there probably are quite a lot of situations where you're in a more sort of group setting outside of your lab. So maybe, have you been to any like conferences or those sorts of public engagement? I'm sure you're used to vigorous not. Could you tell us a bit more about that?

Roshni Malde  17:06  
Yeah. So I luckily, just before the pandemic went to Lisbon for a conference called pigs, I actually presented my poster there. And I actually got invited to do a presentation there as well, which was very exciting, very unexpected, and very scary. Because the majority of the people presenting they're all people from industrial companies and stuff like that. Not many PhD students present. So yeah, very scary, but quite a good opportunity, for sure. And, yeah, definitely so much fun to do it. I mean, I was crazy scared when we did it. But looking back, it's like such a good experience to have. So anyone who's doing a paycheck at the moment should definitely look into doing conferences and stuff. It's such a good experience.

Maymana Arefin  17:52  
Wow, that's really it's so interesting to hear that this is like a common theme. As a PhD student or as a master's student, you keep being the next stage above, which is really impressive. And I guess, yeah, just just building on that a little bit more on the on the conference sort of setup. Do you How does that work? Do you get asked by your group to present something is that something that you have to like apply for.

Roshni Malde  18:16  
So there's certainly conferences happening all the time for different fields, you've got ones for med cam, or for Chem bio, one for proteins, one for antibodies, so on. And so I guess it's just a case of, it's not even like specific to the group or anything, it's just you find one that you particularly are interested in, and you can apply to go to it and stuff. And then so you can either apply to just attend or you can apply to do a presentation you can apply to do a poster. So yeah, this one I just applied to do a poster, and then you've got to get sort of chosen, I think the majority, I assume this is how it works. majority of people do get the want to do a poster, do I end up doing one? So yeah. But then the presentation thing like it or just got asked that I got invited to do that. So yeah, I wasn't expecting to do that one, but definitely quite cool that I got asked. So

Malcolm Chalmers  19:09  
yeah, definitely, definitely. Cool. There was a question that I've been asked by applicants, specifically applicants to the natural sciences course at UCL and I wondered if you would have an insight on it. Obviously, you're doing a PhD in the chemistry department. I'm assuming most of the people that you're working alongside did their undergraduate degrees in their master's degrees in chemistry as well. Are there any ways in which you think doing a natural sciences degree beforehand have been either an advantage or a disadvantage compared to someone who's maybe just on straight chemistry all the way through?

Roshni Malde  19:41  
And I don't think it has disadvantaged me No, I don't think so. Because I think I ended up doing the majority of like the core chemistry modules anyway. So in that way, it's not disadvantaged me. I did. So how my degree worked was essentially chemistry and maths is how like my natural science degree worked. So in first year, students sort of started off with 5050 of both. And then as the years went on, I cut out more and more math and sort of started not liking it as much. It was less numbers and more proving this, that and the other. So the good thing about doing a natural sciences degree is it allows you to like learn to balance so many different things at the same time. So I think that probably is the skill that I came out with after my degree. So yeah, definitely a good thing.

Maymana Arefin  20:28  
I can definitely echo that that balancing act on natural sciences as well. Exactly considerable, but it really is a transferable skill afterwards, isn't that of just yeah, back and being like, oh, wow, I had a lot, a lot going on in my schedule, and I could do all of them. So

Malcolm Chalmers  20:42  
yeah, it's something as I say, when we've had natural sciences, people looking to apply to UCL. One of the questions that we get from them and from their parents quite often is, oh, well, but will they be at a disadvantage compared to single honors students? If it comes to HD? And I've been saying to them, oh, no, no, it'll be absolutely fine. But it's really good to hear from someone who actually did it, that it has been not a disadvantage or an advantage going forward.

Roshni Malde  21:09  
So but also, I think, like, there's a couple of people in my lab that have not even done chemistry, and they've come to a PhD in chemistry. Yeah, exactly. So I think I know, it's incredible. So I think there was one guy that I knew that did a maths and physics degree and then came into your PhD in chemistry. So there you go, and then a couple of people who have done biochem degrees and then comes to it. So I think it's just how much work you put into it at the end of the day, like if you just go outside and learn your own thing. And I think it's possible. So. Yeah, very good.

Maymana Arefin  21:42  
I think there's so much anxiety around kind of having to specialize at a young age, especially in Britain having definite Syria that was that defining your whole trajectory. So it's really nice to hear that people come even to your degree, which seems quite specialized from so many different angles. Yeah.

Malcolm Chalmers  22:00  
So now you're approaching the end of your PhD, this might be a question you're sick of hearing. But do you know what your plans are for the future? Are you planning to continue in academia? Do you have a career path you're looking to go into?

Roshni Malde  22:13  
Yes, I've definitely been asked this so many times. And they all say in realities, I probably don't really know the answer to it. But I guess I know, I want to stay in science. That's something I definitely know. I always thought I never wanted to stay in academia after my PhD. And slowly, slowly, it's maybe becoming an option. But yeah, I would definitely want to stay in science, whether it's academia or industry, I don't definitely know. Yeah, but yeah, sort of the same field continuing on with med Chem Chem bio kind of field,

Maymana Arefin  22:45  
that's positive to hear that you haven't come out of the whole PhD and think I never want to do that, again. It's great that the enthusiasm has kept until now. And actually, I realize we've missed kind of an obvious question, what what are the differences between your sort of work experience in industry compared to in the lab, so in an academic setting,

Roshni Malde  23:07  
it's quite hard to offer this because my industry experience was interesting to say the least. So that really, when I started there, they had, so it was actually a manufacturing site that I was working at. But when I started, they had a major sort of audit happen. And then they, the audit went quite badly. And they essentially had to stop all manufacturing. So the entire time I was there, they weren't actually manufacturing any drugs, which was a bit of a shame. So definitely an interesting experience. I did no science that year. But anyway, but what you do learn from that, though, I think, is just sort of how big companies like GSK are run and it's all very, very top down rather than individual voices being heard. So I think that's the difference between industry well, and smaller companies, and I guess academia as well. So yeah, I guess with academia, you're looking at more about understanding things and that kind of thing. Whereas in big companies like GSK in industry, you're going to be thinking more about just like trying to get your medicines out there as quickly as possible and and stuff like that and making money as well, I guess. Or you You did a month's work experience with GSK. That was actually a week's work experience. Just when I was at school. I had no idea what I really wanted to do. I was looking at all sorts of career pathways at the time. I mean, I thought about engineering and doing or being an optician being a pharmacist, I thought about all sorts at the time. So I think at that age when you're at school, it's always so important to just get so much work experience just that's the only way you're really know what you what you enjoy, I guess so. Definitely a good experience and definitely probably helped me make my decision to do chemistry at uni.

Malcolm Chalmers  24:53  
So if I were a recently graduated master student who was looking to Come and do a PhD in some science subjects. Is there any advice that you could give to me right now? Any things that I could do in preparation that would help me or or things that you weren't expecting from your PhD when you started?

Roshni Malde  25:13  
I think one of the biggest things is probably like project management and time management and stuff. You're essentially you're like, you've got a three year project that you're trying to do. And I guess it's about self motivating yourself. So I think that's something that people should I mean, I don't really know how you gain that without without doing a PhD in the first place. But I think it's just being aware that you've got to be very self motivated. And yeah, yeah, that I think is the most important thing,

Malcolm Chalmers  25:41  
I would have assumed that you would have to be pretty self motivated to get to the stage of doing a PhD. But I'm guessing that's maybe not always the case. So what stage are you at with your PhD right now? Have you completed the draft? If you've got your viver plan? Is there a fiver for chemistry PhDs?

Roshni Malde  26:00  
There is? Yeah. Um, so I was actually meant to finish in March. But then with the pandemic, I've had an extension. So I now finish in September. So I think I definitely need it. So yeah, so I mean, over lockdown, I did end up writing a lot of my introduction and my results and discussions, stuff like that. But I still got a bit to go. And I probably won't end up having handing in or having my Viber until September itself.

Maymana Arefin  26:27  
But I was just wondering, because you've obviously had a lot of experience in Chemical Biology and photo chemistry as well. Is there anything in that sort of area that you've you would really like to work on that you haven't yet? Like? Is there any way it could be in a different field? Is there anything that you've thought, Oh, my God, that's really cool. There's research going on in that, I would love to be one of those groups.

Roshni Malde  26:51  
I mean, like how my project works is I So essentially, I'm doing some like photochemistry on small molecules at the moment, which is just small chemical compounds. And then eventually, the aim is to apply this to a biological context. So I'm starting to do that now. So I think for me, it's more about just like exploring the more biology side of things. So doing more antibody work, maybe even going into like cell work and stuff. So I think that's something that I would possibly want. At some point.

Malcolm Chalmers  27:19  
I've just noticed that we we failed somewhat on an element of our research, because I've been sitting here wanting to talk to you about winning the Ramsay medal in the second year physical chemistry poster prize, and have completely failed to mention that you also won the Davies prize, the Vader prize and the natural sciences distinction prize at the same time. We should just missed over the prize. So are there any years during your degree where you? My third year at uni I think those times where you talk to someone and feel like such an underachiever. It's really shocking.

Maymana Arefin  27:59  
I just can't believe. So. Every time I see my price for me, this is unexpected.

Roshni Malde  28:10  
This is what everyone says to me within the group is people are like, Oh, yes, the next year, you're gonna win another prize? And I'm like, No, I'm not.

Malcolm Chalmers  28:19  
I think that's that's interesting, though, because I think that that speaks a lot for the kind of personality that wins prizes. If If one is the kind of person who comes in expecting to win a prize, invariably, the work rate drops, the standard of work drops, and you end up being middling at best. Whereas the people who come in going like every time shocked that they've won something end up working such a higher level to kind of maintain that. So just to clarify, though, the Davies prize was for the best student presentation in organic chemistry. Was that linked to the poster prize you won?

Roshni Malde  28:57  
Not quite so the second year poster prize. It's also quite funny because because my my PhD is very sort of interdisciplinary. You've got the chem bio side, and I've got the photo chemistry side. So the second year poster prize I want for physical chemistry. And then that third year Davies one was for organic chemistry. So like I said, you have the final year talks and stuff. So everyone competes against each other. So the organic section, which is where I sort of was based for that would compete and I won that one and that's winning that is what puts you forward towards the Ramsay medal. So that I guess is connected.

Maymana Arefin  29:34  
It's reminding me of like a debater competition at different stages and Yeah, exactly. Thinking down chemists left brain senses. Quite a cool image.

Malcolm Chalmers  29:47  
And then I'm looking debate a prize that says he was awarded to the best postgraduate students starting a PhD in chemistry. So as was that kind of like, first week they looked at all of your applications and when

Roshni Malde  29:59  
I didn't I didn't know this existed. So. So Jamie, my supervisor actually just asked me and he was like, Oh, I need to get your grades from your undergraduate degree, and then you get put forward for this possible prize. And I was like, Okay, sure. So yeah, that's how that one works.

Maymana Arefin  30:18  
We've made light of all the prizes. But do you have like a sense of where that work ethic comes from? Because it is actually it's a real like, it seems incredible work ethic?

Roshni Malde  30:29  
I don't know, I guess it's just love of what you do, and also wanting to do the best you can. I think that's what it is always, for me, like I, I would never just do a half hearted talk. Like for the poster prize, for example, I would never just do a random poster and be done with that kind of thing, just because it's for the sake of that I would have always put effort into it. And same with the presentation, I would have always made effort to make it a good presentation. So yeah, I can't I guess it's just that.

Maymana Arefin  30:57  
Yeah. And it's that drive? Would you say that's kind of specific to your love of chemistry, or?

Roshni Malde  31:03  
I mean, I don't think I personally, like I always think, currently, especially with the pandemic and everything. I'm always like, I feel so demotivated, I can't be bothered to do this. And I can't be bothered to do that. But then, I guess at the end of the day, you want to do well. So you are at the back of your mind, you are always motivated.

Malcolm Chalmers  31:22  
You mentioned that like you wouldn't do you know, you wouldn't just submit a half hearted poster or something. Are there any non scientific skills that you really want to improve on right now? Like? Are you looking to maybe learn some graphic design or some video or some kind of Public Engagement kind of measures? Or are you very much the type who wants to be stuck in a

Roshni Malde  31:43  
lab, necessarily? For me, you're gonna laugh at this, but I think I always wanted to improve my presentation skills. That to me, honestly, I get so nervous when I have to do presentations. So I think for me, yeah, I just want more experience in that as well, I guess.

Maymana Arefin  32:02  
I think it's it's one of those things that people who have presented for years and years still find that they're getting, you know, butterflies in their stomach and feeling nervous. So the more practice the better. It sounds like

Malcolm Chalmers  32:15  
a friend of mine once said to me, if you weren't getting nervous about doing something that meant you didn't I always take that. 

Roshni Malde  32:22  
Yeah, you're doing something wrong. Yeah, I've heard that as well. Exactly. 

Malcolm Chalmers  32:26  
The day you stop feeling nervous about stuff is the day you've probably find another path to go down. So but I would just like to say thank you very much for a fascinating conversation and an insight into the work of a PhD student. So thank you very much Roshni for your time  

Roshni Malde  32:41  
Thank you so much. 

Malcolm Chalmers  32:42  
It's brilliant. Thanks to everyone for listening. We'll be back next month with another episode of Hypot-enthuse. Thanks very much.